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OptionZero
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by OptionZero » Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:10 pm

I'm glad they settled the question we mostly knew the answer to - Ishimori is joining BC OG. Glad they got a good worker, his addition to these battles will add some kick in the ring at least

Speaking of which - neither BC OG or BC Elite have enough jrs to field a contender in the Jr Tag division
They've already run R3K against Suzuki-Gun a couple times already
With Hiromu down, LIJ doesn't have a team.

So really . . . other than like, Kushida-Taguchi what jr tag teams could even challenge?

It sounds like they need an infusion of outside talent or to call up some young lions on excursion to fill out the ranks.

Kawato's in mexico, it seems like he's a perfect fit for filling out LIJ's ranks.

Would they push Umino up this early? Team him with, i dunno Kushida or somethin?

I wouldn't mind seeing Taguchi-ACH again

there's probably a Dragon Lee - Titan teamup they could borrow


EDIT:
Crap, I forgot an obvious one - Flip Gordon and Scurll. They already have a damn theme song. They could even get some mileage out of teaming them up without officially making Flip a BC or Elite member

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Tigerkinney
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by Tigerkinney » Sun Aug 12, 2018 10:16 pm

OptionZero wrote:
Sun Aug 12, 2018 9:10 pm
With Hiromu down, LIJ doesn't have a team.
Hiromu's a big loss, not just to L.I.J but to the Junior Division in general. Outside of the Big 5 (Omega/Okada/Tanahashi/Naito/Ibushi) I think he might arguably be the biggest star in the promotion.

With the reported severity of how bad a shape Hiromu is in, I would assume that the IWGP Junior belt is going to have to be vacated. Be interesting to see how they go about finding the next champion and who they end up putting the belt on, if that ends up being the case.

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b3nfox
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by b3nfox » Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:01 am

OptionZero wrote:
Sun Jul 29, 2018 4:51 am
After the most recent results, the Strong Style Unleashed card on 9/30 in Long Beach is starting to take shape:

ZSJ is beating Kenny the next B block night. If he loses he's mathematically eliminated, and he's not getting cut this early, particularly with a Naito matchup at Budokan. He is also quite over in the US due to his PWG/Evolve stuff, so ZSJ v Kenny rematch for the title in Long Beach is your main event

Juice v Tama Tonga. This was set-up by the Night 2 matchup that Tama won. Juice also lost to Naito, Omega, and Toru yano, but those dudes aren't US title material. Juice is over AF in America, and Tama Tonga will have interest due to the BC civil war stuff. I also expect that GOD will beat Young Bucks for the Tag belts at the G1 final

Hangman Page vs. Jay White. This will get page over even more. Switchblade is a hated man.

Young Bucks vs. Leo Tonga and Bad Luck Fale. BC civil war shit. This could also be expanded with Hikuleo and Haku if everyone's healthy, and you can throw in Cody and Scurll on The Elite side
Welp, ZSJ didn't beat Kenny so that bit went out the window. They're sure as shit not doing Yano/Omega at Long Beach and will probably just skip his title claim altogether seeing as only won via interference. They're also not going to do Ibushi/Omega again so soon, so I presume either Kenny isn't on the Long Beach show (if his heel injury is legit), or more likely he'll just be in a tag match (GL vs GoD maybe?)

He'd then have one title defence before WK13, against Ishii at KoPW in October. The Destruction shows and Power Struggle could be headlined by secondary titles, as they were last year (though that could be complicated by the fact the IC title is currently on ice). I guess Tana could defend the briefcase too, against White or maybe even Okada.

Assuming Omega retains at WK13, after that is where it gets interesting. You'd think the IWGP champion will have matches at New Beginning, Sakura Genesis, and the MSG show. To complicate matters, Sakura Genesis and the MSG show are also very close together. If Jericho is still IC champ by then, it's possible he could headline Sakura Genesis against, say, Tanahashi, seeing as he definitely won't be working the MSG show.

That would then leave them to figure out just one defence for Omega, at New Beginning, if they want Omega vs Ibushi to headline at the Garden.

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OptionZero
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by OptionZero » Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:51 pm

There's zero chance Kenny isn't on the long beach show


They can stick him in a Golden Lovers tag and let Ibushi do the heavy lifting if his foot is hurting. Either GOD, or maybe Naito-Sanada or somethin'. It'll still be good, and it'll have weight

Hell, i wouldn't even be upset at a kenny/yano non-title affair

Bloodbuzz Bunk
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by Bloodbuzz Bunk » Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:46 pm

So we have the Destruction/FSU cards. Major matches on major shows:

Destruction in Hiroshima:
-Never Openweight 6 man tag titles: Taji Ishimori &GoD(c) v Taguchi, Juice, & Finlay.

- IWGP Heavyweight Title: Kenny Omega(c) v Tomohiro Ishii.

Destruction in Beppu:
-Never Openweight Title: Hirooki Goto(c) v Taichi
-Special Single Match: Tetsuya Naito v Minoru Suzuki

Destruction in Kobe:
- IWGP Jr Heavyweight Title Tournament Semi-Final:
Bushi v Kushida
- WK13 Briefcase: Hiroshi Tanahashi v Kazuchika Okada

FSU:
- IWGP Jr Heavyweight Title Tournament Semi-Final:
Marty Scurll v Will Ospreay
- IWGP Tag Team Titles: Young Bucks(c) v GoD
-IWGP U.S. Heavyweight Title: Juice Robinson(c) v Cody

My Takes:
- Love the balls the office has when it puts guys in prove it situations. Naito wanted to avenge his poor draw at Beppu last year and he has that opportunity. Juice also got the big pressure spot to prove he can main event a show without one of the big four.
- I’m shocked that Okada v Tanahashi is happening before a potential match with Jay White. That should hit that 5,500-6,000 average attendance for that show though. Also leads me to think that no matter who wins, the winner still has White to look forward too.
- I’m glad to see the IWGP Heavyweight Title defended in September again. It always felt like one defense in the last 5 months before the Dome was a little lite. Also there are quite a few Golden Lover tag matches in Korauken Hall and other Road To shows so that should be fun and might lead to the Ibushi v Omega rematch at KOPW.
- I like that the last 4 Jr champs are the only ones in the Jr Title Tournament. It makes it feel a little more important and exclusive imo.

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frankpellow
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by frankpellow » Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:29 pm

Some really great marque matches there and also some good stuff on the 'road to' shows and Destruction undercards.
Ayato Yoshida returns for multiple shows which is interesting and i guess they must see a lot in him. He's got a few singles matches (as has Henare) on the televised shows.
Beretta, Chuckie T and KES all back again and squaring off at two of the Destruction shows(?).
Ospreay & Ishii v Golden Lovers on the 7th should be great
Kojima returns in the main on the 9th tagging with his fellow New Japan Dads.
Honma is working the whole tour so his comeback seems to be on track.

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Frank Olson
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by Frank Olson » Tue Aug 21, 2018 1:50 am

In the few years that I've been watching it seems that September is the least exciting month for New Japan (aside from December when we are in the dregs of the World Tag League) but these Destruction lineups look decent. It's interesting that they are doing the Omega/Ishii match on the Hiroshima show rather than at King of Pro Wrestling, which, as Bloodbuzz Bunk points out above, would suggest that there will be another IWGP Title defense prior to the Tokyo Dome. Perhaps they headline KOPW with Omega/Ibushi? Seems a little early for another match between those two already, but I don't see any other obvious challengers for Kenny.

The Tanahashi/Okada match for the briefcase at Kobe should be great too. I know that we've seen these guys wrestle each other a million times, but their matches are always great so I'm not disappointed that we're getting it again so soon after the G1 match. Plus this is the first time I can recall where it actually seems like there is a chance of the briefcase changing hands. It would seem kind of weird for Tanahashi to beat Okada after they definitively established that Okada was on a different level as recently as May, but it would also be weird for Okada to win the Tokyo Dome shot when he is in the middle of this storyline where he's lost his way. It feels like they've booked themselves into a corner, but I'm confident that they have a plan.

I can't say that I'm at all excited about the LIJ/Suzukigun stuff. The feud felt random to me when it was happening in the spring and didn't really lead to any good matches (aside from the Jr Tag Title match between Hiromu/BUSHI and Kanemaru/Desperado), so I'm not looking forward to a repeat of it in the fall. I'm also really not into Goto/Taichi at all. So that Beppu show is really not doing much for me.

I am excited for the returns of Beretta and Kojima, even though it doesn't look like the latter is really doing anything of consequence. I'm also looking forward to seeing more of Ayato Yoshida. I don't watch K Dojo and I haven't done a good job of keeping up with the Lions Gate shows, so this tour will be my first real exposure to him (I did see him in the 6-man opener at the G1 Finals show, but he really didn't do anything there).

The CHAOS vs. Bullet Club Elite tag matches look like they will be highlights of the tour, with Ishii/Ospreay vs. Golden Lovers (9/7 Road To show), Ishii/Yano/Ospreay vs. Omega/Ibushi/Yujiro (9/8 Road To show), Ishii/Yano/Ospreay/Beretta vs. Omega/Ibushi/Yujiro/Owens (9/9 Road To show), and Best Friends/Ospreay vs. Ibushi/Yujiro/Owens (Destruction in Hiroshima) all sounding like very fun tag matches. I can't even say that Yujiro is a weak link in these matches, as he's surprisingly been having an under the radar good year as an undercard tag guy.

RPG 3K vs. Umino/Narita, from the Kobe show, also sounds like it will be a really fun undercard tag.

I like the idea of this mini-tournament to crown a new Jr champ. I can't say that I'm all that excited for KUSHIDA/BUSHI, since we've seen it a million times and it's only really delivered two or three of those times, but the Ospreay/Scurll matches are always good so I expect that to deliver.

The lineup for the US show does not look very impressive so far, but we do have to keep in mind that they aren't going to announce anything for Omega, Okada, Tanahashi, Naito, etc. until they've had their big matches on the Destruction tour, so I think the card will ultimately fill in nicely. It is looking pretty inessential at the moment though.

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Gerard
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by Gerard » Tue Aug 21, 2018 10:38 am

I know people saying having Tanahashi beat Okada now would undo a lot of the previous booking but what if it's to build to Okada vs. Tanahashi at MSG which will have more impact running it there than if they try to have another rematch after Destruction in Japan. I'm now convinced Tanahashi is beating Kenny at the Dome and dropping it to Okada in MSG, Naito wins the next G1, etc.

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Rich Kraetsch
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by Rich Kraetsch » Tue Aug 21, 2018 1:28 pm

Gerard wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 10:38 am
I know people saying having Tanahashi beat Okada now would undo a lot of the previous booking but what if it's to build to Okada vs. Tanahashi at MSG which will have more impact running it there than if they try to have another rematch after Destruction in Japan. I'm now convinced Tanahashi is beating Kenny at the Dome and dropping it to Okada in MSG, Naito wins the next G1, etc.
That's not a bad scenario at all and I've been advocating giving American audiences Okada vs. Tanahashi for awhile now, particularly with it not drawing as well in Japan anymore. I think undo may be strong but it just feels empty if Tanahashi is just BACK to the ACE. It felt like he was firmly planted a peg below some of the up and comers (Naito, Okada, Omega, etc.) so to have him just back on top just feels weird. It's obviously a much different situation but almost has a NOAH going back to the Kobashi well too many times feel. A WWE-esque push the veteran over the younger guys vibe to it.

Again, it's not as extreme as those and honestly I don't care THAT much that Tanahashi is in that spot as he's awesome and one of my all-time favorites but I think him going to, main eventing and even winning at Dome would feel like a few steps back from where we were.

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Gerard
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by Gerard » Tue Aug 21, 2018 2:20 pm

Yeah I agree with you undo is probably a strong word, but it is an objection I've seen in a few quarters. I don't necessarily have an issue with Tanahashi back as the ace because it's definitely a temporary thing. If he doesn't beat Omega at Wrestle Kingdom, I doubt he's ever getting that last run as IWGP champ.

I think it still works because of the context of the Okada slump. Keep Okada in the slump until Wrestle Kingdom where he claws his way back from there. Given the timing of the MSG show, they can book the New Japan Cup winner to be the one to get the title shot at MSG which would be a great use of the tournament for the redemption of Okada storyline.
Rich Kraetsch wrote:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 1:28 pm

That's not a bad scenario at all and I've been advocating giving American audiences Okada vs. Tanahashi for awhile now, particularly with it not drawing as well in Japan anymore. I think undo may be strong but it just feels empty if Tanahashi is just BACK to the ACE. It felt like he was firmly planted a peg below some of the up and comers (Naito, Okada, Omega, etc.) so to have him just back on top just feels weird. It's obviously a much different situation but almost has a NOAH going back to the Kobashi well too many times feel. A WWE-esque push the veteran over the younger guys vibe to it.

Again, it's not as extreme as those and honestly I don't care THAT much that Tanahashi is in that spot as he's awesome and one of my all-time favorites but I think him going to, main eventing and even winning at Dome would feel like a few steps back from where we were.

Bloodbuzz Bunk
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by Bloodbuzz Bunk » Tue Aug 21, 2018 8:07 pm

The way these cards lined out it leaves a lot of room for several wild yet plausible scenarios:

Option A) Tana beats Okada clean. Okada slumps his way to a wake up call type match with Jay White at WK13 leading to some sort of redemption arc for the G1or Dominion. Tanahashi faces Omega at WK13 and the outcome is literally determined by Omega re-signing or not.

Option B) Okada beats Tanahashi. Okada accelerates the redemption arc, beats White at KOPW, and Omega at WK13 and Omega’s status has little bearing on the match outcome. Tanahashi goes back to doing Tanahashi things with the IC title in the semi main event.

Option C) White interferes and cost Okada the match with Tanahashi. Okada saves face and the whole “Tana is no longer the Ace, Okada is Ace hence Tana can’t best Okada anymore” story remains intact. Okada returns the favor to White at KOPW and then we got a western style blood feud on hand for WK13 and Okada basically skips the redemption arc and probably wins the title at NB or MSG which probably more or less renders Omega’s contract status moot in regards to the WK13 outcome.

If I had to put percentages on it I would say Option A is 35%, Option B is 55% , and Option C is 10%. But it’s hard to see where all this goes overall and WK13 wise until we get past the Destruction in Kobe show which is awesome because I don’t think we have really had to ponder the ramifications of the Destruction tour or KOPW tbh in 2-3 years.

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OptionZero
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by OptionZero » Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:46 am

Posted this in the US wrestling forum but it seems particularly relevant here:
PAC/Neville is now free!!!!!!!!
http://www.prowrestlingsheet.com/nevill ... 4DAmbhrxhE

The possibilities seem endless. PAC has name value, he wrestled at fuckin' Mania; he's done Japan before in Dragon Gate.

This seems like an unprecedented situation. PAC was given a gimmick as Neville, "King of the Cruiserweights" and played the role BRILLIANTLY, and now he can take that character and use it on the indies, whether he works as a Jr or not

Taking the vacant Jr. Heavyweight championship seems like a no-brainer. He could light the world on fire with matches against Kushida, Marty, Ospreay, R3K, Ishimori, Suzuki gun. That's a damn year worth of matchups. He could join any faction and instantly form a credible jr. tag team championship contender

He could be an unaffiliated guy that just puts up 5 star matches against any heavyweight

hell, put him with the Tongans, and they'd have two fantastic workers in Pac and Ishimori. Imagine if GOD held the Tag belts and Ishimori/PAC held the jr. tag belts while also challenging for singles matches

He could join Suzuki gun as a vicious heel, serving as a high-flying component they don't currently have

He could join CHAOS and align with, or against Jay White in this leadership battle

Whats the one thing BC Elite lacked? A high-profile RIVAL. Daniel Bryan talked about this, becoming the opponent needed to push them; well, now Neville is the perfect guy; even more so with Elite being face-leaning. Bring Neville in and have him beat the shit out of Kenny, Matt, Nick, Marty, whatever. Print money from that

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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by rollup » Tue Sep 04, 2018 1:11 pm

normal new japan service should return soon ,though the destruction tours have usually been lackluster

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Frank Olson
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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by Frank Olson » Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:19 pm

Destruction in Hiroshima was an okay but largely skippable show. Omega/Ishii was good, though probably my least favorite of the matches they've had together. It was missing the ferocious pace of their 2017 Dontaku or G1 2018 matches, the first-time freshness of their 2017 New Japan Cup bout, or the drama of their 2017 US Title Tournament final. Autumn IWGP Heavyweight Title defenses always have a bit of a drama issue in that it's just a little too obvious that the champion is going to retain. Plus there's the issue that the matches are never quite as good as the G1 matches that set the defenses up, because the tournament setting allows for the fun novelty of midcarders getting the upper hand on main eventers in a way that you just know that they can't in a Title defense. Ishii is the best of the gatekeepers at making me suspend my disbelief and forget about booking logic, but there was never a moment in today's match where I believed that he had a chance. That said, it was still a high quality match and easily the best thing on the show. The leaping foot stomp was really impressive, and it's always fun to see Ishii pulling out nonstandard moves like hurricanranas.

I thought the second-best match on the show, surprisingly, was the 2-minute Bad Luck Fale/Toa Henare match. They smartly built off of the squash match from the G1 Final show by having Henare come out of the gates and throw everything he had at Fale. It wasn't enough to get the job done, but even though Henare still got beaten very quickly you could clearly see a progression from his performance in the previous match. I love these long-term stories in New Japan where you can follow a young wrestler's progression against a veteran opponent.

I also enjoyed the Ospreay & Best Friends vs. Ibushi/Owens/Yujiro match. Ibushi's surprisingly strong tag team chemistry with the lower-rung Bullet Club guys has been one of the nicest surprises of the year, and they had some impressively smooth double and triple team moves in this match. I hope that they are genuinely building to an Ospreay vs. Ibushi match, because they are certainly teasing it a lot and it would definitely be incredible.

The rest of the show was okay but nothing special. Nothing was bad (except possibly for the Goto & Friends vs. Taichi & Friends tag match, which I fast forwarded through) but nothing particularly stood out either. KUSHIDA/Liger/Tiger vs. RPG 3K was a solid opener with a nice hot tag from KUSHIDA. The only thing I really took away from the KES return match against Elgin & Yoshida was that Lance Archer didn't do his usual "spitting water at the crowd" entrance, which was fine with me since I wouldn't mind never seeing that again anyway. Taguchi's spots with the rugby helmet in the NEVER 6-man match were pretty funny, but the match was just okay, and was disappointingly lacking in the excellent Ishimori/Finlay exchanges from the Korakuen Road Tos. LIJ vs. Suzukigun was pretty much the same match those two stables have been having against each other all year. Tanahashi & Friends vs. Okada & Friends had some fun interactions between Okada and White, plus an interesting ending with YOSHI-HASHI seeming to blame Okada for the errant boot that led to the finish, but as a bell-to-bell match it wasn't anything spectacular.

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Re: Strong Style Spirit - New Japan catch all thread

Post by Gerard » Sun Sep 16, 2018 3:51 am

Yeah I would give Omega vs. Ishii only ****1/4. Good to great match but it was disappointing given what they've done before. It could have been 10 minutes shorter and should have been structured more like US tournament finals or their G1 match. A more frenetic pace in those matches worked and in the Hiroshima match I felt like at times they were trying to put together a 30 minute match for the sake of going 30 minutes.

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