Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson Announces Retirement

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BCP
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Re: Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson Announces Retirement

Post by BCP » Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:03 pm

JML wrote:I agree that the pace that WWE guys go at now is fast but it ain't as fast when Kurt Angle was in the company along with Benoit and Eddie being alive. I pulled up a Smackdown from the Smackdown Six era and they were going at a pace that would Dolph Ziggler look like Dory Funk Jr. I think those guys pushed the work and pace as far as it can go in WWE. Once those guys were gone, the pace lessened a lot. They do more ridiculous stuff like the Big E and Ryback stuff but it's not to the level where the Smackdown Six were.
Worth noting though that you've named three of the best wrestlers of all time, and that you've listed three people and four people are dead, and Angle's hardly a picture of health.

I also think Eddie's particularly interesting because one of his issues was he put on enormous muscle mass without wanting to slow down as much as he should have (he did slow down a bit, I'm not denying that)

If you look at Rollins' injury, it seems to me he's put muscle mass on, how much of that is trying to look like John Cena while still wrestling like Tyler Black?

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Rich Kraetsch
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Re: Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson Announces Retirement

Post by Rich Kraetsch » Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:22 pm

mlev76 wrote:For those who may curious, here is how Bryan's PPV placement looked from the beginning of 2012 (right after he won the world belt) through the last PPV he was on prior to his brief return in 2015.

28 Pay Per Views
29 Matches (not counting any MITB cash ins)
8 Main Events
7 Non Main Event World/WWE Title matches
6 Secondary Title Matches
4 Non Title Gimmick matches
4 Non Title matches

Now, this doesn't tell the whole story, but Bryan was clearly near or at the top of the card much of the time after he was first positioned in the World/WWE title scene.
Wrote about this in April of 2014 as well: http://www.voicesofwrestling.com/2014/0 ... tatistics/

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Re: Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson Announces Retirement

Post by DXvsNWO » Thu Feb 11, 2016 7:13 pm

From Nigel McGuinness (via ROH's website):
I remember the first time I heard the name American Dragon Bryan Danielson. It was the summer of 2002 and I was languishing in the WWE developmental system without a contract and no reason to think I’d ever get one. After discussing my feelings with fellow non-contracted wrestler Brian “Spanky” Kendrick, he gave me a VHS cassette of the then-fledgling independent company Ring of Honor, telling me this was where the best wrestlers of our generation were going, and one of his former training partners, Bryan Danielson, was one of the top guys there. I took the tape home and watched the show, half impressed with the believability of the style, half reluctant to think I could ever work that style myself.

Fast forward to the following summer, and a couple of learning intensive tours with Brian Dixon’s All Star Wrestling promotion in the UK, and I was ready with a British style that could find me a spot within Ring of Honor. I remember the first time I saw Bryan - in the locker room, early in the day, before my first show with the company, the first ROH had ever run in Ohio. He was sitting quietly by himself, reading a book. People would come by and he’d look up with a gentle smile as he genuinely shook their hand. He had a quiet air of self-repose and confidence that, even in that moment, made him subliminally stand out of the crowd. And I swear, as I write this now, I knew then in that moment, somehow, that he would play as big a part in my career as anyone else on earth; when at the time there was no reason to think perhaps we’d even ever wrestle.

Over the next year or so, as I had positively received matches within the company, I would watch from behind the curtain pretty much every other match on the show, but certainly every one that followed me, avidly if it involved guys like Samoa Joe, Homicide, Christopher Daniels and Bryan. He had this fluidity, and presence, that drew people to him, and went beyond the moves. I once asked him after a show what he thought I needed to do to move up the card. He told me he had no idea.

By the spring of 2006 I had a solid reputation within the company, developing a harder hitting style, while booker Gabe Sapolsky had brilliantly booked my run as the Pure Champion. I first wrestled Dragon in Cleveland. It was only supposed to be a one-off match. But I realized on that night what I’d felt intrinsically that first moment I’d seen him in the locker room - we had an unmistakable chemistry together. You can call it premonition, clairvoyance, I don’t know. But it was undeniable.

Dragon got the best out of everyone. He never had a bad match; most were outstanding. Like Kurt Angle after him, he had an innate ability to take what I brought to the table and make the perfect match out of it. Because of the success of our first match, Gabe booked us together perfectly in a program that led to a big match in my home country, in August of that year, on the first solely ROH show ever in that country: In the main event, with both his World title and my Pure title on the line.

It would certainly be fitting to call the match epic. I’d thought about it for months beforehand, every angle, every possibility. The crowd that night was electric and as the match progressed, it drew everyone in. Late in the match I got busted open on the ring post, and nearly counted out. The emotion from the crowd when I rolled in at the last second was one of the most visceral, authentic, reactions I ever felt, and I struggle to describe in words. Jimmy Rave, watching in the wings of that old theater in Liverpool, told me afterwards it was the single biggest reaction he’d ever heard from a live crowd. Fists shaking with rage, we clashed in one more exchange before he finally ended the match with elbows.

We had more matches for ROH, including my last ever one for the company. We got to travel the world wrestling in Japan, Australia and all over the US. We became friends outside the ring too, sharing more than just a common interest in wrestling. We argued over philosophical questions like whose feet were better looking, whether dogs were more intelligent than humans, and whether clam-digging was a worthwhile pastime.

After we left ROH our lives went in very different directions and for a long time we lost touch. Just recently, however, we reconnected and even if it is the only time, I will be glad of it, and just as glad of everything else we shared, both inside the ring and out.

For me, however, the memory that will stand out the most perhaps, was from the Manhattan center in New York City, in a match he had with someone else. I’d gone one before him with Naomichi Marufuji, one of the most exciting and talented junior heavyweights in Pro Wrestling NOAH at the time. It was a huge chance for me to stake my claim as a top guy and thanks to Marufuji’s brilliance we tore the place up. In my career I was always my own worst critic, but for once I came to the back half-filled with a notion of “follow that motherfucker,” and half afraid we’d done a little too much.

But Dragon went out there with Kenta, and a torn labrum nonetheless I believe, and put on a classic that is still remembered today. I watched from the corner of the balcony of that iconic venue, drawn on to the edge of my seat every time I, like every other single person in attendance, thought the match was over. After the third or fourth time, I felt the rising noise from the crowd quieten in my head, my breath slow, the hairs rise on the back of my neck, and I’m not afraid to say, my eyes well up with tears, realizing I was watching a special moment, a truly beautiful art in its most authentic form. Dragon is one of those people who, when you see just how talented he is, makes you think there just might be a God after all.

Excerpts from Nigel's upcoming autobiography Bumping Monkeys.
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Re: Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson Announces Retirement

Post by mlev76 » Fri Feb 12, 2016 12:04 am

Rich Kraetsch wrote:
mlev76 wrote:For those who may curious, here is how Bryan's PPV placement looked from the beginning of 2012 (right after he won the world belt) through the last PPV he was on prior to his brief return in 2015.

28 Pay Per Views
29 Matches (not counting any MITB cash ins)
8 Main Events
7 Non Main Event World/WWE Title matches
6 Secondary Title Matches
4 Non Title Gimmick matches
4 Non Title matches

Now, this doesn't tell the whole story, but Bryan was clearly near or at the top of the card much of the time after he was first positioned in the World/WWE title scene.
Wrote about this in April of 2014 as well: http://www.voicesofwrestling.com/2014/0 ... tatistics/
Reading Dave's article made me wonder what would have happened had he never been cut in 2001 or if he had been pursued and signed in 2005 like Punk and Joe were by WWE and TNA. There's no way of knowing, but I feel like he could have done well earlier than he would have later on because by the time he would have been re-signed, he would be too 'foreign" for WWE to get behind and I'm not sure he'd have had the drive/political allies to push passed it like Punk did.

I enjoyed his WWE run, but would obviously have liked to have seen him have a longer run in total, been booked better and not had the meaningless 2011.

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Re: Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson Announces Retirement

Post by suplexberry » Fri Feb 12, 2016 6:01 pm

It sounds really weird and perhaps hyperbolic to say but Daniel Bryan taught me what wrestling is. I used to watch as a teenager but I was texting my friend during episodes of Smackdown, kind of half-mocking it, half-enjoying it, so I never got into the matches as I do these days. My favorite guy was always Eddie Guerrero, but not for his matches, his character work (now I obviously love both!). Then one day in 2013 I decided to watch Raw online, and actually kind of got into it. Bryan wasn't my #1 guy right off the bat but his matches against the Shield guys slowly got me into not just the characters and the storylines, but the stories within the matches. By Summerslam I was all in on this guy, and by then I was learning more about wrestling history, indy wrestling, all these facets that were unknown to me previous.

It's kind of fascinating because modern WWE announcing and presentation doesn't tell you to enjoy wrestling matches on their own, but Bryan's matches, the chemistry he had with other guys and the crowd reactions finally made the in-ring action "click" with me. I slowly got it, and it made me investigate other technical greats.

In some ways I owe my fandom of other promotions to Bryan as well. If he'd been tearing it up after winning the title or even making Smackdown the best show on TV after that IC title win, I don't know if I would've dropped out of following WWE so much. I began watching NJPW around the time Bryan first got hurt in 2014, and while it was probably coincidence more than causation, it feels appropriate somehow. His matches brought me to ROH, and to PWG. When he got injured the second time, me and a friend had a running chat about our "D. Bryan replacements", where she would be like, "Zack Sabre Jr because technical prowess" and I'd be like "Mike Bailey because he kicks people and is an underdog". We had literal lists of people trying to cobble together a perfect replacement for Bryan, and would watch this promotion, that promotion, to find the next Daniel Bryan. But alas, there is only one.

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Re: Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson Announces Retirement

Post by JML » Sat Feb 13, 2016 12:11 am

Hearing a guy like Bomani Jones talk about Daniel Bryan on his ESPN radio show was kinda alarming cause this will be a concussion story that is gonna be explored more in mainstream media.

Even though he called wrestling "rasslin", he's a pretty smart guy and pulled up the Tommy Dreamer situation along with Maroon and his tie in to the NFL.

I could easily see Danielson on HBO Real Sports, Vice or even 60 Minutes about his condition and the history of concussions

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Re: Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson Announces Retirement

Post by rovert » Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:03 pm


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Re: Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson Announces Retirement

Post by rovert » Sun Feb 14, 2016 5:24 am


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Re: Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson Announces Retirement

Post by rovert » Mon Feb 15, 2016 7:40 am



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Re: Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson Announces Retirement

Post by mlev76 » Mon Feb 15, 2016 2:17 pm

rovert wrote:
I'd expect many who read this thread have heard that show, but if not, it's really a must listen to. DKP can be hit and miss, but when it hits, it's usually tremendous and this was tremendous.

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