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VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 4:34 pm
by Rich Kraetsch
This week on the Voices of Wrestling flagship podcast, Joe and Rich bury a ridiculously awful WWE Extreme Rules 2018 show, preview Impact Wrestling's Slammiversary XVI, catch up on the G1 Climax 28 , preview what's to come this weekend from NJPW, wedding strategies and much more.

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Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 5:56 pm
by supersonic
Synopsis is last week’s.

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:22 pm
by Rich Kraetsch
supersonic wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 5:56 pm
Synopsis is last week’s.
Fixed

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:38 pm
by armsofsleep
The flatout stink list is almost correct, but I'll add that Nia Jax's matches in NXT vs Bayley and Asuka were better than a lot of much more hyped women's workers in the company have ever ever had. Yeah maybe she was carried a bit but IMO her matches are also just agented poorly.


Also should mention that you HAVE to mention Styles' saddled feuds over the past 18 months. Similar to how we do for Bryan:

- Jinder
- Shane
- Owens/Sami (I know they're lauded as good workers but they were one of the worst acts in the company at the time)
- Owens solo
- Nakamura

But of course, the Balor match delivered. The Cena matches delivered. The ORTON match even delivered. The Lesnar match was a MOTY level match. Even the Mania match with Shane delivered. I don't think he's a best in the world level guy right now, but I'm not going to call him mega overrated or anything when all of his singles matches against big time opponents (before the Rusev/Almas matches) have delivered 1000%.

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:41 pm
by IIDXias
personally i find all the matches you listed as "delivering" as extremely overrated except mayyyybe the balor match (that's just a little overrated i guess). i think AJ isn't very good now but i also totally buy the idea that he's just stopped trying because what the fuck does having really great matches on the main roster even get you these days? but man, having a pretty average match with rusev in a spot where they could have had a great one and then having a close to flat out BAD match with almas are back to back black marks on his record that you cannot excuse away with quality of opponent. right now he should not even get a vote for #100 in the WDKW 100, but i'm sure he'll still finish top 5 anyway somehow.

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:58 pm
by King Of Indy Style
While I agree that AJ is overrated in terms of having matches not as good as people would lead you to believe, is Rusev really THAT good where the blame almost all on Styles? Granted I haven't watched WWE in about 3 years now, but I don't recall Rusev being particularly good in ring back when he was the Anti-American heel in 2014

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:32 pm
by mlev76
AJ peaked at the 2017 Rumble and really hasn't broken past a 4 star match since. You can point to opponents, but he's somewhat fallen into Bret Hart 'five moves of doom' repetitiveness.

i'm curious if anyone else watched the show or at least parts of the show not live and how it affects their feelings about the show. Only parts I saw lived were the last two matches both of which I enjoyed.

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:32 pm
by mlev76
IIDXias wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:41 pm
personally i find all the matches you listed as "delivering" as extremely overrated except mayyyybe the balor match (that's just a little overrated i guess). i think AJ isn't very good now but i also totally buy the idea that he's just stopped trying because what the fuck does having really great matches on the main roster even get you these days? but man, having a pretty average match with rusev in a spot where they could have had a great one and then having a close to flat out BAD match with almas are back to back black marks on his record that you cannot excuse away with quality of opponent. right now he should not even get a vote for #100 in the WDKW 100, but i'm sure he'll still finish top 5 anyway somehow.
I doubt he's top 50 for anyone at this moment. Too many others having much better years.

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 11:27 pm
by BoxingRobes
AJ has just devolved into token house style and no one is even attempting to take the formula and kick it up a notch.

I'm convinced this is a directive from the very top to simply not have great matches or matches that even venture into that. Just go out there, do what the producers ask of you and get to the back with something as inoffensive as possible and the result is everything in this ** to ***1/2 spectrum. Even by standards in their own company, everything is substandard and drifting into the effort you'd at a House Show in Albany, NY on a Wednesday in August after a European Tour (ie: lazy and uninspired)

As discussed in a previous thread...NXT and 205 Live are exceeding the quality by such a margin, I can not imagine the main roster not being given a directive to simply work this uninspired style.

Some of the greatest workers in the world are in this company with a long history of caring about their in-ring performances and everyone works like they no longer give a fuck. Just going through the motions.

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:11 am
by mlev76
See, while I do think there is overproduction at play, I don't think it's intentional with the point of making the matches not as good. And you do regularly see matches above the spectrum you mentioned, but often times, it's in multi person matches. I'm thinking various Chamber/Rumble/multi man matches where maybe it's harder to control or plot out set points.

AJ specifically just hasn't been at the same level as he was between the Roman feud (probably Roman's best in ring feud) and the end of the Cena feud.

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:27 am
by BoxingRobes
mlev76 wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:11 am
See, while I do think there is overproduction at play, I don't think it's intentional with the point of making the matches not as good. And you do regularly see matches above the spectrum you mentioned, but often times, it's in multi person matches. I'm thinking various Chamber/Rumble/multi man matches where maybe it's harder to control or plot out set points.

AJ specifically just hasn't been at the same level as he was between the Roman feud (probably Roman's best in ring feud) and the end of the Cena feud.
I would tend to side with you if there wasn't an absolute wholesale trend here at play. Some of the greatest wrestlers of all time - collectively - having some of the most uninspired performances of their careers at the same time.

That isn't intentional. I won't buy it.

The only guy looking like he is putting some effort into things...Seth Rollins...and wrassletwitter blows their load over him as a Wrestler of the Year Candidate...and its starting to look obvious that was a blip on the radar of his year.

On the exact opposite end of the spectrum...Shinsuke Nakamura...perhaps the most transparent wrestler on planet earth when it comes to how many fucks he gives and he has given negative fucks from the very second he stepped on the main roster and it continues to decline.

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:22 am
by BlizzardAcolyte
Listening now, this month's payment was justified by Rich's "torch this POS" bit alone. (Since we're talking about people caring/not caring about their performance at work...)

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:25 pm
by rovert
AJ Styles could be just getting old guys. He's 41 years old. He looked fairly haggered in photos at the panel with Mattel at San Diego Comic-Con on Thursday. Elaborate conspiracy theories are great and all but he's a dude who started working a full-time schedule very late into his career. Also, around Wrestlemania time at one stage he was set to miss months of action due to an injury that turned out to be not that serious. It is highly likely he has nagging injuries.

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:26 pm
by Leo C
Makabe's gonna pin Okada in Hachioji, you'll see. It's his home turf.

Re: VOW Flagship: Extreme Rules, G1 Climax, Slammiversary & more!

Posted: Fri Jul 20, 2018 2:12 pm
by rollup
whether or not he wins the block, White should be losing at least twice before the final day , as he now has 6 pts and the head to head over both tana and okada.

Tana vs okada is going on last at Budokan and it will decide the winner of the block, so logically that means White will be trailing one of tana or okada , needing to beat evil and hoping for results to go his way.