WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

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TGD287
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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by TGD287 » Sat Sep 12, 2015 1:55 am

DETROIT_KEJB wrote:It brings me to a point, actually. I have always been looking and searching for a website or whatever that lists indy shows across the country. Over the years there have been one or two and they usually don't last. Have you guys ever thought about hosting a list? Ya know, promoters can send in the details and your site can be the place to go for anyone looking to find indy shows in their area.
Nate Stein maintains a mailing list of events with locations and websites that gets passed around to the big sites, which are occasionally posted as articles. I roll my eye at it because I get the feeling he's not doing any work in researching the promotions, and that even mid-level promotions won't be listed if they don't explicitly tell him (at one point no AAW, for example). And the actual format is hap-hazard, as they're not in any kind of order. And yes, it is a good service, and free, so I shouldn't really complain, but it could be done so much better.

One website would be nice, but some regions may have forums that do that. I don't really check there anymore, but chiprowrestling.proboards.com is a good roundup of upcoming local events.

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by Hobbes » Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:05 am

Just got to the part where Rich does a special Jared from Subway's voice. Rich did some voice a week or two before that I wish I could remember, but it was great. If there is ever a VOW Patreon, an audio file of Rich and his Cavalcade of Characters needs to be a donation incentive.

Joe Lanza hunting down Michael Elgin to set him straight on BigMike origins is my WON storyline of 2015.

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by Ageyev » Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:30 pm

They seem to have edited out the bit where Joe hands Balor the belt.

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by Ageyev » Mon Sep 14, 2015 2:56 am

Joe, there are people from all over the world living in Ireland. I was out with some Venezuelans recently. On Saturday I got a haircut from an Iraqi barber and I once worked with a man who moved here from Congo to escape some militia who wanted to Kim him and his family.

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by BoxingRobes » Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:25 am

The reason Dave Meltzer rates Randy Orton as the 23rd biggest draw ever and rates The Big Show relatively high is because his method for determining what is a draw is archaic and does not apply to the modern WWE landscape/model. It is the same reason why he cannot adequately determine how to quantify what is or is not a draw on the independent scene. The landscape has changed dramatically and the older methods of stress and what is or is not a draw no longer apply throughout.

Meltzer's method only qualifies John Cena and perhaps Brock Lesnar as candidates who tick off the drawing box in the US post Attitude Era.

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by BoxingRobes » Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:47 am

Rich Kraetsch wrote:
Quentin Moody wrote:I guess I'm the guy here who keeps up with current hip hop and listens to a ridiculous amount of it. I love my 90's/early 2000's stuff because even though I'm a young guy, my dad would always play Common, Little Brother, Outkast, De La Soul, Pharcyde, Sean Price, Talib Kweli, etc so I love that stuff. But there is so much great stuff coming out still.
Do you have a Spotify playlist of what you've been listening to lately? I will listen to most new hip hop releases but they dont have the same impact on me as that 90s/00s period had. It could be the time I devote to listening to the music as well. I dont think quality has gotten lower I just think I've outgrown the genre. It's very much a "young mans" game and it's hard to find much connection to modern hip-hop when I'm approaching 30.
I'm curious how suburban whitey teenager Rich connected to the street poetry of early 90s inner city of 2Pac or the wild styling of a hot Atlanta summer that produced Outkast.

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by Rich Kraetsch » Mon Sep 14, 2015 2:27 pm

Or maybe I connected to underground hip hop in the late 90s/early-to-mid 2000s?

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by Joe Lanza » Mon Sep 14, 2015 4:20 pm

BoxingRobes wrote:The reason Dave Meltzer rates Randy Orton as the 23rd biggest draw ever and rates The Big Show relatively high is because his method for determining what is a draw is archaic and does not apply to the modern WWE landscape/model. It is the same reason why he cannot adequately determine how to quantify what is or is not a draw on the independent scene. The landscape has changed dramatically and the older methods of stress and what is or is not a draw no longer apply throughout. .
Completely agree. In this era, the brand draws the houses, and we've reached a point where I seriously think that you put on the Mania show doesn't matter all that much (to a point, obviously) because "WrestleMania" is the draw. We can't measure PPV anymore, and that was really the last good indicator for these guys.

When it comes to modern WWE candidates, fair or unfair I go gut. And my gut tells me that guys like Big Show, Orton, Edge, Kane, etc didn't make any kind of difference at a HOF level, and I see none of them even close on terms of work or influence (maybe Edge?). What makes Orton a better candidate than Greg Valentine, JYD, Ivan Koloff, and a million other 70's & 80's guys who you could argue directly drew money on top before you even bother debating work? And I wouldn't (and haven't in some cases) vote for any of those guys (although I'm fence sitting JYD). I'm really not moved by the idea that Big Show headlined X amount of 10k house shows because it was Cena or Taker or Rock who mattered, not him. He could have been any upper mid carder and the show would have still drawn the same. The WWE brand is worth a few thousand before you even post the card.

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by InYourCase » Mon Sep 14, 2015 4:40 pm

BoxingRobes wrote:
Rich Kraetsch wrote:
Quentin Moody wrote:I guess I'm the guy here who keeps up with current hip hop and listens to a ridiculous amount of it. I love my 90's/early 2000's stuff because even though I'm a young guy, my dad would always play Common, Little Brother, Outkast, De La Soul, Pharcyde, Sean Price, Talib Kweli, etc so I love that stuff. But there is so much great stuff coming out still.
Do you have a Spotify playlist of what you've been listening to lately? I will listen to most new hip hop releases but they dont have the same impact on me as that 90s/00s period had. It could be the time I devote to listening to the music as well. I dont think quality has gotten lower I just think I've outgrown the genre. It's very much a "young mans" game and it's hard to find much connection to modern hip-hop when I'm approaching 30.
I'm curious how suburban whitey teenager Rich connected to the street poetry of early 90s inner city of 2Pac or the wild styling of a hot Atlanta summer that produced Outkast.
Outkast speaks a universal language, brother. How could anyone not love them?

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by dancecab » Mon Sep 14, 2015 6:37 pm

Fun show once again gentlemen. Yall make work more bearable. Loved the outer with Flava in ya ear should totally be your new gimmick.

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by Rich Kraetsch » Mon Sep 14, 2015 6:48 pm

The Fray Movement wrote:
TGD287 wrote:Obviously I'm intrigued by the Allstate Arena talk.

"Two doors to get in, so it takes three hours to get out." I have to question that, as there are like five different entrances on the outside. I've never really had a problem physically getting out of the building.

But yeah, the biggest issue is traffic and parking. I'm shocked you didn't mention that there's not enough parking to hold building capacity, so they park everyone three rows together, and if you end up in the second row, you're trapped until your neighbors leave. And even if you get out of your row quickly, you can only move cars so fast through one major road.

Although I was trying to find information about the old renovation, as I have no memories of it, I found a proposal for a new one. Larger seats would be nice, but I really wish they'd add Metra support. Just build a station, and have trains ready to leave afterward.

(edit: oh, the link is an embed? cool)
I'm sure things have changed from 2011 when I was there for Money in the Bank but I remember being surprised at the ease of getting into the place. Got there three hours beforehand. Twenty dollars to park right by the building. Walked around Office Depot and Target to kill the time. Saw the doors were opening and literally walked in the front door.

Now, post-show was another story as we decided to go next door and eat some iHop. And besides, we had just witnessed, in person, the greatest WWE PPV of all the time. Who needs to drive right after that anyway?
I, too, went to the iHop after MITB '11. We could've created wrestling's biggest power couple right then and there!

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by H.U.S.T.L.E. » Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:12 pm

Great as usual fellas, and I enjoyed your take on Tom Green's article. He did an interview last week with the PWPonderings crew that was a good "companion piece" as well.

One other thing to add to the discussion: Konnan and Court had a very interesting discussion about the modern indy scene and how there's a relative lack of ego across the board. Konnan has said multiple times on the MLW podcast that sees it as a huge positive in that this generation of wrestlers are much more laid back & not worried about protecting a spot. And we see that illustrated in the fact that lots of veteran guys are willing to give back and do jobs to up and coming talents.

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by Rich Kraetsch » Tue Sep 15, 2015 1:50 pm

TGD287 wrote:
DETROIT_KEJB wrote:It brings me to a point, actually. I have always been looking and searching for a website or whatever that lists indy shows across the country. Over the years there have been one or two and they usually don't last. Have you guys ever thought about hosting a list? Ya know, promoters can send in the details and your site can be the place to go for anyone looking to find indy shows in their area.
Nate Stein maintains a mailing list of events with locations and websites that gets passed around to the big sites, which are occasionally posted as articles. I roll my eye at it because I get the feeling he's not doing any work in researching the promotions, and that even mid-level promotions won't be listed if they don't explicitly tell him (at one point no AAW, for example). And the actual format is hap-hazard, as they're not in any kind of order. And yes, it is a good service, and free, so I shouldn't really complain, but it could be done so much better.

One website would be nice, but some regions may have forums that do that. I don't really check there anymore, but chiprowrestling.proboards.com is a good roundup of upcoming local events.
We've wrestled internally with the idea of doing an indie calendar or something to this effect but it's just such a hard to maintain project. We'd have to have someone on staff who really only handles that. It's also not our forte and much more something PWPonderings would excel at. We've had the idea of doing JUST ones on iPPV and that's not hard but does lose some of the point of letting people know about shows in their area.

Yes, Nate does the list but it's a fucking mess, it's not in alphabetical order and it's just a gigantic list of shows, not necessarily an iCal or something that can easily be digested.

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by Blue_Period » Tue Sep 15, 2015 4:10 pm

Great show, as usual, this week. I must admit, as much as I love the actual wrestling conversation, I always really enjoy the tangential musings. The handshake discussion had me laughing out loud (and my wife shooting me dirty looks.) It's one of the things I've always made note of when meeting wrestlers over the years.

Elgin didn't have a very remarkable handshake. It wasn't as firm as you would expect, very hot and sweaty though.

Adam Cole was like shaking hands with a lady- slight hands with slender fingers, weak grip, almost greasy from moisturizer.

AJ Styles had the classic limp noodle handshake, nothing behind it, and shockingly little hands. It was like shaking hands with my five year old son.

Nakamura had an odd handshake where he just held his hand out straight and shook too quickly. It was as though he had the basic concept, but didn't understand or execute on the finer points (sort of like a Roman Reigns match.) In retrospect, the point you made about the Japanese not handshaking as a common practice, made me feel a little bad and judgy. I'm ashamed that I hadn't thought of that cultural aspect, especially since I'm pretty sure that I did a weird half-bow thing about three times during the handshake.

My friend had an unusual experience with Rhino. He was trying to shake Rhino's hand but he sort of put his arm up, like it was in an invisible sling. After a few awkward moments, my friend realized that Rhino was after a sort of forearm bump, a la late 80's/early 90's Bash Brothers. He must be a germaphobe or something.

The strangest handshake I had with a wrestler happened last year at the ROH/NJPW show in Toronto. I was about to get a signed photo from reDRagon. I had met Kyle O'Reilly a few weeks earlier at Smash Wrestling and I had run out of bills, so I paid for an autograph with toonies (Canadian two dollar coins.) He remembered and mentioned it as I approached them, so we had a laugh and made small talk for a minute or two. Bobby Fish, feeling neglected I guess, wedged his way in between us, grabbed my hand, and shook it very firmly... for about fifteen seconds... while staring me right in the eyes with all of the intensity that he would bring to a main event match. Boy, was that ever uncomfortable!

Keep up the awesome work guys. I'm also thrilled to see the upstart New Japan Purocast joining the fold- another great podcast! My two favorites, now in the same feed.

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Re: WON HOF, Dusty Rhodes Tag Team Classic, Double ROH Preview & more!

Post by Joe Lanza » Tue Sep 15, 2015 10:59 pm

Blue_Period wrote:Great show, as usual, this week. I must admit, as much as I love the actual wrestling conversation, I always really enjoy the tangential musings. The handshake discussion had me laughing out loud (and my wife shooting me dirty looks.) It's one of the things I've always made note of when meeting wrestlers over the years.

Elgin didn't have a very remarkable handshake. It wasn't as firm as you would expect, very hot and sweaty though.

Adam Cole was like shaking hands with a lady- slight hands with slender fingers, weak grip, almost greasy from moisturizer.

AJ Styles had the classic limp noodle handshake, nothing behind it, and shockingly little hands. It was like shaking hands with my five year old son.

Nakamura had an odd handshake where he just held his hand out straight and shook too quickly. It was as though he had the basic concept, but didn't understand or execute on the finer points (sort of like a Roman Reigns match.) In retrospect, the point you made about the Japanese not handshaking as a common practice, made me feel a little bad and judgy. I'm ashamed that I hadn't thought of that cultural aspect, especially since I'm pretty sure that I did a weird half-bow thing about three times during the handshake.

My friend had an unusual experience with Rhino. He was trying to shake Rhino's hand but he sort of put his arm up, like it was in an invisible sling. After a few awkward moments, my friend realized that Rhino was after a sort of forearm bump, a la late 80's/early 90's Bash Brothers. He must be a germaphobe or something.

The strangest handshake I had with a wrestler happened last year at the ROH/NJPW show in Toronto. I was about to get a signed photo from reDRagon. I had met Kyle O'Reilly a few weeks earlier at Smash Wrestling and I had run out of bills, so I paid for an autograph with toonies (Canadian two dollar coins.) He remembered and mentioned it as I approached them, so we had a laugh and made small talk for a minute or two. Bobby Fish, feeling neglected I guess, wedged his way in between us, grabbed my hand, and shook it very firmly... for about fifteen seconds... while staring me right in the eyes with all of the intensity that he would bring to a main event match. Boy, was that ever uncomfortable!

Keep up the awesome work guys. I'm also thrilled to see the upstart New Japan Purocast joining the fold- another great podcast! My two favorites, now in the same feed.
This is my new favorite post on the entire forum.

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